The claim that Ibn Taymiyah said Allah’s Istiwa is like my istiwa (Naudhubillah)
I saw some people quoting the following statement
التقي الحصني عن أبي الحسن علي الدمشقي عن أبيه.
قال: (كنا جلوساً في صحن الجامع الأموي في مجلس ابن تيمية فذكّر ووعظ، وتعرض لآيات الاستواء، ثم قال: (واستوى الله على عرشه كاستوائي هذا) قال: فوثب الناس عليه وثبة واحدة، وأنزلوه عن الكرسي، وبادروا إليه ضرباً باللكم والنعال وغير ذلك
That Taqi al Hisni from Abul Hasan Ali ad-Damishqi from his father that He was with Ibn Taymiyah in Jam`e al amwi and Ibn Taymiyah said Allah’s Istawa is like my Istiwa. [Daf`a ash-Shubha page 123]
Response
This is a lie because He is same Taqi al Hisni who lied and said:
وكان الشيخ زين الدين بن رجب الحنبلي ممن يعتقد كفر ابن تيمية وله عليه الرد. وكان يقول بأعلى صوته في بعض المجالس: معذور السبكي – يعني في تكفيره
al-Shaykh Zayn al-Din ibn Rajab al-Hanbali was from among those who firmly believed in ibn Taymiyya’s kufr (disbelief), and had (authored) refutations against him. He would say at the top of his voice during some gatherings:
“al-Subki is excused – meaning in regards to his takfir“.
[al-Hisni, Daf’ Shubah man Shabbaha wa Tamarrad, ed. Dar al-Mustafa, pg. 535, tranlation taken from a sufi website]This is a great lie because Ibn Rajab al Hanbalee said in his own book after the death of Shaykh ul Islam Ibn Taymiyyah
الإمام الفقيه، المجتهد المحدث، الحافظ المفسر، الأصولي الزاهد. تقي الدين أبو العباس، شيخ الإسلام وعلم الأعلام، وشهرته تغني عن الإطناب فعب ذكره، والإسهاب في أمره
Imam, Faqeeh, Mujtahid, Muhaddith, Hafidh, Mufassir, Asooli, Zahid Taqi al-din Abul Abbas Shaykh ul Islam, The prominent among the prominent.. [Dhayl Tabqaat al Hanabilah 2/387]
This is the reason the scholars said he was a fanatic and a liar as Sakhawi (student of Ibn Hajar al Asqalani) said in the book الضوء اللامع 5/269
وذكره المقريزي في عقوده باختصار وقال إنه كان شديد التعصب للأشاعرة منحرفاً عن الحنابلة انحرافاً يخرج فيه عن الحد فكانت له معهم بدمشق أمور عديدة وتفحش في حق ابن تيمية وتجهر بتكفيره من غير احتشام بل يصرح بذلك في الجوامع والمجامع بحيث تلقى ذلك عنه أتباعه واقتدوا به جرياً على عادة أهل زماننا في تقليد من اعتقدوه وسيعرضان جميعاً على الله الذي يعلم المفسد من المصلح ولم يزل على ذلك حتى مات عفا الله عنه
Maqrizee mentioned in his book ‘Uqood briefly that he was very fanatic for Asha’ira, deviated from hanabila (and) in this he exceeded limit, There were numerous matters of him with hanabila in Damascus and he was atrocious regarding Ibn Taymiyyah and proclaimed takfeer of ibn taymiyyah without any decency and rather was explicit about it in his book jawam’i wal majam’i and his followers learned that from him and followed him as is the norm of people of our times in doing taqleed of the one whom they believe in, The two (Ibn taymiyyah and the one who did takfeer of him) will be brought before Allah together, The one who knows wicked and righteous. He was upon it until he died, May Allah forgive him (end quote)
Shaykh Zubair Ali Zai said regarding Taqi al Hisni:
“Taqi al Din al Hisni was an innovator who was staunch against Shaykh ul Islam, and the criticism of opposer who narrates whatever he heard without any reference is rejected. [al Hadith 90 page 24]
Now it is proven with a proof that Taqi al Hisni is a liar, second narrator is Abul Hasan Ali ad-Damishqi.
Ibn Hajar al asqalani said he was against Ibn Taymiyah
عَليّ بن اسمح اليعقوبي الشَّافِعِي عَلَاء الدّين الْمَعْرُوف عَليّ منلا نَشأ بِبِلَاد التتار ثمَّ قدم الرّوم ثمَّ تزهد وَدخل دمشق سنة بضع وَثَمَانِينَ وسِتمِائَة فقطنها وَكَانَ يلف رَأسه بمئزر صَغِير كثير الصيانة والقناعة شَدِيد الْحَط على ابْن تَيْمِية وَحج سنة 710 وَمَات باللجون رَاجعا عَفا الله عَنهُ وإيانا
He was known with the name of Ali bin Ahmad Yaqoobi the Shafiee, Ala ud din, Ali Manla. He was born in the country of Tatar then went to Rome, Then he indulge in Zuhad and War`a and went to Damishq in 680 h, He used to tie a light weight cloth over his head. He was careful and content. He was severely against Ibn Taymiyyah, did hajj in 710 h and when he was coming back, he died at the place of Lajun. May Allah forgive all of us. [ad durar al Kaminah 3/158]
So, it is known that he was staunch against Ibn Taymiyyah and can they quote trustworthiness of the third narrator i.e. his father who narrated this lie?
Yes ITS A LIE because Shaykh ul Islam Ibn Taymiyah himself said
ومن شبهه باستواء المخلوقات على المخلوق فهو مشبه
whoever did Tashbeeh to Istawa then he is Mushabiha. [Quoted by Mulla Ali Al qari in [Mirqaat al Mafateeh Kitab al Libaas, vol 8 page 217 under the hadith 4340 dar ul kutub Ilmiya]
After that Mulla Ali al Qari said:
وتبين مرامه ، وظهر أن معتقده موافق لأهل الحق من السلف وجمهور الخلف ، فالطعن الشنيع والتقبيح الفظيع غير موجه عليه ولا متوجه إليه ، فإن كلامه بعينه مطابق لما قاله الإمام الأعظم ، والمجتهد الأقدم
The meaning of Ibn Taymiyah is cleared from his quote and his aqeedah is clear and this is the aqeedah of people of truth among the salaf as-Saliheen and Majority of the Khalaf. So it is not right to slander him and we should not ponder upon those who do this. His saying is same as Imam al Adham and Greatest of the Mujtahid (Abu Hanifa) [Mirqaat al Mafateeh Kitab al Libaas, vol 8 page 217 under the hadith 4340 dar ul kutub Ilmiya]
So he himself said They are Mushabiha who do tashbeeh, then how can he say Allah’s Istiwa is like mine naudhubillah?
Islamweb fatwa no. 280102 states:
Shaykhul-Islam Ibn Taymiyyah may Allaah have mercy upon him said:
“What applies to the Divine Essence applies to the Divine Attributes. Allaah The Exalted is unique; nothing compares to Him in terms of His Essence, Attributes and Actions. Since Allaah The Exalted has a Divine Essence that is unique and is not like that of any of the created beings, this Divine Essence has Attributes that are also unique and do not resemble any of those of created beings. If a person asked about the Istiwaa’ (Allaah’s mounting the Throne), he should be answered with the well-known answer of Maalik and Rabee‘ah may Allaah have mercy upon them: ‘The Istiwaa’ of Allaah is known, the ‘how’ of it is unknown, faith in it is obligatory, and asking about it is a heretical innovation because no human being can answer such a question.” [End of quote from islamweb]
Ibn Taymiyyah also said in ‘at-Tadmuriyyah’ (pg. 20)
“Whosoever says: His Knowledge is like my knowledge, His Power is like my power, or Love like my love, or Pleasure like my pleasure, or Hand like my hand, or ASCENDING LIKE MY ASCENDING , or His Nuzool (descent) is like my descent, then he has resembled and likened Allaah to the creation. Rather it is a must to affirm (Allaah’s Attributes) without resemblance, and to negate (what Allaah negates for Himself), without ta`teel (divesting Allaah of His Attributes).”[Above quote is taken from the post by Br Abu Hudhayfah from his article Exposing Kabbani 2 : Imaam Tirmidhi’s Reply to Kabbani]
He also said
وَمِنْ غُلَاةِ الْمُجَسِّمَةِ الْيَهُودِ،
The jews are the Ghulaat al Mujassima [al Jawab as-saheeh liman Badal Deen al Maseeh 4/456]
There are many other quotes in the book “Bara`at Shaykh al Islam ibn Tamiyah min Tuhmat al Tashbeeh wal Tajseem”
Shaykh al Islam Saleh bin Umar Siraj ad din al Bulqini said
ولا عبرة بمن يرميه بما ليس فيه، أو ينسبه بمجرد الأهواء لقول غير وجيه، فلم يضره قول الحاسد، والباغي والطاعن والجاحد.
وما ضر نور الشمس إن كان ناظراً .
We do not agree with those who falsely blame him, or attribute something bad to him with their desire. Envious, aggressor, mocker and denier can not harm him. “There is no fault in the light of the Sun…when the eyes are always closed” [al Radd al Wafir Ibn Nasir al-Din ad-Damishqi page 249, Ghayat al Eemani fe Radd al Nabhani 2/161-164]
Ibn Hajar al Asqalani refuted this claim of innovators that
وهذه تصانيفه طافحة بالرد على من يقول بالتجسيم ،
His (Ibn Taymiyah`s) books are filled with refutations of those who promoted anthropomorphism (Tajseem) and his disavowal thereof. [Al-Radd al-Waafir by Imam Ibn Naasir al-Deen al-Dimashqi (p. 145, 146), al-Haafiz al-Sakhaawi – the student of Ibn Hajar – quoted the words of his Shaykh in his book al-Jawaahir wa’l-Durar (2/734-736).]
Mulla ‘Ali Qaari defended, after quoting the false claim of al Haytami that Ibn Taymiyah did tajseem.
أقول : صانهما الله عن هذه السمة الشنيعة والنسبة الفظيعة
I say: Allaah protected them (Ibn al-Qayyim and his Shaykh Ibn Taymiyah) from this abhorrent accusation. (i.e. Tajseem). [Mirqaah al-Mafaateeh by al-Mulla ‘Ali Qaari (8/146, 147)
And when brother of Ibn Taymiyah had a debate with Ashari qadhi Ibn Makhloof on the issue of NUZOOL and ARSH, He was dominent on him
Ibn Kathir said:
وفي هذا الشهر يوم الخميس السابع والعشرين منه طلب أخوا الشيخ تقي الدين شرف الدين وزين الدين من الحبس إلى مجلس نائب السلطان سلار، وحضر ابن مخلوف المالكي وطال بينهم كلام كثير فظهر شرف الدين بالحجة على القاضي المالكي بالنقل والدليل والمعرفة، وخطأه في مواضع ادّعى فيها دعاوى باطلة، وكان الكلام في مسألة العرش ومسألة الكلام، وفي مسألة النزول.
On thursday 27th of this Month both of the brothers of Ibn Taymiyyah i.e. Sharf ud din and Zain ud din were brought to the sitting held by deputy of Sultan Salaar. Ibn Makhloof al Maliki also came and they argued. Sharf ud din was dominent on Qadhi Maaliki in naql, knowledge and evidence. And made his many of the claims false. The debate was on the Mas`ala of Arsh, Kalaam and Nuzool [Al Bidaya wal Nihaya 14/59]
And that is why Mahmud Shukri al Alusi said
فلا تجد في عصر من الأعصار من يذب عنه ويختار قوله ويسلك مسلكه إلا وهو الفائق على غيره ذكاء وفطنة وإنصافاً، ولا تجد من يخالفه ويعاديه إلا وهو من أهل الغلو والغباوة وحب الدنيا والمخالف للسنة والمعادي للحق،
We can not find any era where someone who defended him [Ibn Taymiyyah], and accepted his statements and on his Maslak without realizing that He (the defender) is far better than others in sharpness, intelligence and Insaaf. Nor can we find anyone who went against Ibn Taymiyyah and harbored enimity for him without realising that [such a person] was from the extremists, those of stupidity, an opposer of the Sunnah, and an enemy of the truth. [Ghayat al Eemani fe Radd al Nabhani 2/179]
Conclusion
1. What those extreme sufis mentioned against Ibn Taymiyyah is a clear lie because Ibn Taymmiyyah himself went against the stance i.e. To say Allah’s istiwa is like creation then he is Mushabiha.
2. Only Wahdatul wajoodis wenst against him otherwise great names among the scholars defended him. Even Mulla Ali al qari defended him and said his aqeedah is like Abu Hanifa ra, what is the status of these self proclaimed scholars against Ibn Hajar al Asqalani and others?
3. Ibn Taymiyyah was Shaykh al Islam, for more information read our articles regarding life of Ibn taymiyah and praises of scholars.